news-engine

It’d be fair to say David Moyes finished last season as something like public enemy number 1 among Evertonians. Not every Evertonian, of course, but a fair chunk of the fanbase seemed ready for a change. The run-in was dismal and Everton — Moyes, his players and those at the top of the club — all played their part in squandering a fantastic chance to get the club back into Europe. It might have been ahead of schedule, but development and progress in football is never linear. You can’t just rely on a pre-defined plan; things don’t always happen when you expect them to, and you have to be ready to pounce on an opportunity when it comes your way. I’m on record as writing that, if the right manager was available at the end of last season, then I’d have been open to a change. But Everton elected to stay with Moyes, and while there is still some understandable frustration with the Scot, there is no evidence to suggest the club are willing to make a change just yet. There is also nothing to say that Moyes is seen as Everton’s long-term manager. Indeed, Angus Kinnear had the chance to say something along those lines in his interviews last week, but he strayed clear of committing. However, I do get the sense that right now, Moyes can’t do right for wrong with some among the fanbase. Even after Saturday’s win over Crystal Palace, frustration and ire was directed at Moyes for his post-match comments. Moyes is a cautious, pragmatic manager. Maybe he’s overly cautious and overly pragmatic, and that can come across as negative. But it is that cautious nature and pragmatism that has seen him manage 20+ seasons in the Premier League. There is a reason only two managers — Arsene Wenger and Alex Ferguson — have overseen more matches in the competition than Moyes. Now that pragmatic nature is probably also what, in part, has held Moyes’ teams back, but that doesn’t mean that everything he says has to be looked at through that lens, either. The comments that seemed to draw particular frustration centred around Harrison Armstrong, who had an excellent game in the heart of Everton’s midfield. Armstrong was not perfect, and neither was Hayden Hackney, on his Premier League debut, but they dovetailed together nicely and seemed to improve as the game wore on. Moyes suggested that Armstrong would not perhaps have been playing as much if Everton had a full complement of midfielders available, with James Garner only fit enough for the bench and Christian Nørgaard and Tim Iroegbunam out injured. However, Moyes was at pains to say, in all of his TV interviews and his post-match press conference, that Armstrong is impressing hugely and currently holds his place on merit. Yet that, apparently, was too negative. Moyes shouldn’t say anything about Everton’s injuries; instead it should just be blind praise of the teenager. In no way was Moyes critical of Armstrong, though. What he said was absolutely correct, because in no world is Armstrong, on paper, Everton’s first-choice midfielder if the squad is fully fit and available. But they aren’t, and over the course of pre-season Armstrong has proved he is a capable player and an exceptional talent and, on Saturday, he showed he can more than hold his own in the Premier League. That’s fantastic, but it doesn’t mean Armstrong will go through the whole season as first choice. He will have ups and downs, he may sustain an injury or gets suspended. He is 19. He is still learning, and while it is vital that young players do get minutes to develop, I do struggle with this expectation among modern fans that youngsters also have a right to play every single minute they possibly can. Moyes will always be more cautious than some more progressive or younger coaches. I don’t think you can argue with that. But it doesn’t mean everything he says or does is wrong, or that he’s a dinosaur for suggesting Armstrong may not necessarily have been first choice if Garner — Everton’s Player of the Season last year — or Nørgaard — a reigning Premier League champion — had been available. That doesn’t mean Moyes doesn’t rate Armstrong, because it’s very clear over the last eight months that he does, and it doesn’t mean Armstrong won’t play, because he will. The balance has to be right with how Moyes handles Everton’s younger players and it’d be fair to say that he hasn’t always struck that balance. I don’t think that’s the case with Armstrong, though. He has been handled well and we are reaping the rewards of that. There’s still a long way to go. But while we can all get frustrated with Moyes, and I’ll stress again, it’s absolutely fair for him to be criticised, he doesn’t have to be criticised for every single thing, especially when he is just talking sense. So maybe in this regard, we might all cut Moyes a bit of slack. Read more - What we learned: Everton 2-0 Crystal Palace Reader Comments (71) Note: the following content is not moderated or vetted by the site owners at the time of submission. Comments are the responsibility of the poster. Disclaimer () 1 Posted 24/08/2026 at 10:31:20 The noose is already too slack. 2 Posted 24/08/2026 at 10:46:07 Unless Armstrong makes consistent mistakes that lead to goals against or losing possession, then he should be allowed to learn from his mistakes; Ross Barkley springs to mind. The answer may have to wait until all are fully fit but Garner coming on did make me wonder how fit he might be, having missed the friendlies owing to surgery, while the same may also be said of Norgaard. 3 Posted 24/08/2026 at 10:46:22 And on the subject of youngsters, a good manager will select a team based on their recent form and performance, not by reputation. Moyes has a reputation - all throughout his career - to drop in-form players as soon as his favourites become available. Criticising this is valid, isn't it? 4 Posted 24/08/2026 at 10:51:16 He's out of touch. Regressive. Has 0 inter personal skills. Stubborn. Dogmatic. Dithering and plain crap 5 Posted 24/08/2026 at 11:01:53 6 Posted 24/08/2026 at 11:03:45 7 Posted 24/08/2026 at 11:23:23 A good thing with Moyes I can say is his time at West Ham. After giving them silverware, he left in good terms with the fans, and could've kept improving them in his own way. We will see the real work in September-October, whether or not, it pays off here at Everton. He knows the drill, he just needs others around him to do the right things. 8 Posted 24/08/2026 at 11:27:10 There seems to be a disconnect with him and the board/owners, and this is probably due to his contract having one season left with no sign of a renewal. What are the clubs' long-term plans? It's looking likely that Moyes isn't a part of it, so where does that leave him and his ambition for the season? Will he go for it and try to go out in a blaze of glory? Not likely, but it would be interesting at least. Or will he just run his contract out his way? stubborn, pragmatic,dithering etc. It's not a healthy position for a club to be in with the very real threat of players downing tools if things don't go right, as he won't be here long. There are an intriguing few months ahead. 9 Posted 24/08/2026 at 11:42:34 A ton of nutty poured over him. 10 Posted 24/08/2026 at 11:43:31 And here we are now, with the billionaires refusing to spend on fullbacks. And he's signalling to the fanbase that that's what their MO is. He didn't need to do that, he could have kept his mouth shut and just taken the money. 11 Posted 24/08/2026 at 11:52:08 Very sensible and balanced. I'm a Moyes fan and although can see the pain of the run in and how it impacted the fan base confidence, I can also see all the strong changes he is making. He is building a great foundation for years to come. He has turned an aging, highly paid, low ceiling squad into a younger, progressive and high ceiling group of players. With lots of value on upsale in the coming years. Virtually all the players state that he is the reason why they have come to Everton, amongst other things as well. Some of the comments from players about positive vibes and leadership are consistent. He is a passionate Evertonian and I don't know any other Manager that could have come in from Dyche and immediately turn it around like he did. His masterstroke of immedialey getting JOB on the pitch at right back worked a treat in that period. His use of Rohl as an attacking progressive RB on Saturday another good selection - not in line with all the negative comments on here. As for the made up gap between Moyes and Kinnear etc is plain fabrication. They are 100% on the same page and both have said there is much work to do in the transfer window. Proof etc in the eating but we have a clear focus on RB and they refer to getting additions in other positions as well - presume strikers plus some exits. Lets be balanced as a supporter group - pure negativity and making things up does not make for enjoyable reading. I believe Preston is a difficult hurdle and with three games in 8 days it will be a difficult shout on selection for Wednesday with a partially fit squad still missing a couple of additions. Lets get behind the Manager, CEO, Recruitment Team and the rest of the coaching and management staff. COYB's !!! 12 Posted 24/08/2026 at 12:01:11 Albeit it still doesn't absolve him from responsibility for Global Warming, Pandemic, Middle East & Ukraine conflicts etc.🤷♂️ 13 Posted 24/08/2026 at 12:28:06 You must be new to ToffeeWeb! 14 Posted 24/08/2026 at 12:42:16 It's true he took a team only fit for a relegation battle and got them in contention for Europe. This is a massive achievement. It's also true that he messed up the last 7 games and lost that opportunity by not being brave. His dogged, structured style had the team over deliver on the first point. But It was also the reason he under delivered on the second as the squad ran out of steam. The funny thing is, if he had farted around in 14th or 15th all season and we were safe with 3 or 4 games to go, it would have been hailed as a successful season. It's the hope that kills you. 15 Posted 24/08/2026 at 12:55:55 We keep going over the same ground, back and forth. As I have said a few times, give him credit when it's due. Last season, yes, we flopped at the end of the season... but he got us into a better position up to then that I for one didn't foresee at the start of the season. We are all frustrated with our lack of success but to keep blaming managers for it, is forgetting all the other elements that you need for a winning club, most importantly the players. Find what we think of as a better manager by all means, but we have tried many with little or no difference to results. 16 Posted 24/08/2026 at 12:57:05 The interesting thing about this article, Patric, is that we won't know if Moyes deserves some slack for a few weeks. When everyone is fit, and his favourites aren't on form -- do the squad players get a chance? History suggests... no they don't, as illustrated so glaringly at the end of last season. I will never hide the fact that I think Moyes is the wrong manager. No, he isn't building a strong foundation -- arguably successive managers after his first term struggled to overcome the mess he created. Yes, he makes it look stable... but -- until he shows consistent progressive ideas -- he cannot deserve any slack after so long in charge with no success. 17 Posted 24/08/2026 at 13:08:53 He's getting the best out of certain players -- credit. He completely ignores other players even though there's not much wrong with them -- credit against. He's “turned an aging, highly paid, low ceiling squad into a younger, progressive and high ceiling group of players. With lots of value on upsale in the coming years.” -- absolutely no credit. It seems clear to me that these signings are the recruitment team that many lambast. These are the signings that owners want. Moyes resists these players and won't play them (see Dibling, Aznou, Alcaraz, Röhl for most of last season). He even stated that he wouldn't play Hackney if others were available. Moyes wants the likes of Norgaard and Tarkowski. He probably wanted Gueye re-signed. My reading of our transfer policy under TFG is that we've signed very well and Moyes has failed to use and develop them. The ‘disconnect' seems to be that the owners and executives want to recruit in the “Brighton, Bournemouth, Brentford” model where Moyes wants aging, ‘ready now' players who will join his clique. I've said elsewhere that Moyes clearly must do a slightly hidden c.80% of the job really well (discipline, work ethic, professionalism, team unity, ‘Plan A' tactical preparation) but seems to be weirdly stubborn in the visible 20% of the job (team selection, tactical flexibility, substitutions and media interaction). ToffeeWeb often falls into the trap of insisting on a binary opinion of Moyes -- he's either all bad and “has to go now!” or he's the only man who could have saved us and “who could do better?” -- so how dare you criticise him? Amazingly, this is over simplified. Moyes does plenty right, but his mistakes and weaknesses are so glaring that we all see them and he often seems unwilling to learn and develop simply on principle because he seems to think he must know best. Playing a midfielder at right-back instead of a centre-back is a tiny step forward... Can he take more? 18 Posted 24/08/2026 at 13:10:44 From 4 January (after he's returned from loan) he played in every Everton game until 28 February, a total of 10 games on the trot. I think it's fair to say most Everton fans were impressed with him and could see a developing talent there... if he was given game time. But Moyes decided he was getting a bit too big for his boots. So, for the next 10 matches that took us to the end of the season, Armstrong was sat on the bench, getting just three runouts of 4 minutes, 1 minute, and 28 minutes in the final end-of-season fiasco. With the team visibly crumbling in each successive game as that terrible run-in dragged out, his senior players supposedly gassed out through having to play too many games, Moyes resolutely refused to give one of his most promising young prodigies decent game time. It's gonna take me a long time to recover from witnessing that. 19 Posted 24/08/2026 at 13:15:09 He could have switched the team around last year, but with just Patterson, McNeil, Dibling, George, Alcaraz, Aznou and Armstrong being the only available changes in the last 4 games to change the starting XI, the gung-ho among you would have taken a chance on 4 of the latter 5. But who out of Röhl, Garner, Ireogbunam, KDH and N'diaye would have been dropped to make way for them? His real test will be this year where there is now a choice of players for each position. Will he switch them around? Will he play a different team depending on the opposition and whether it is home or away. Wednesday will be the test. Aznou for Mykolenko? Dibling for N'diaye, Garner for Armstrong (he needs minutes), Alcaraz for KDH, Johnson for George, O'Brien for Branthwaite (not 2 games a week yet), Beto for Barry (Nooooo!), Travers for Pickford. If he does that then if he loses he will be slated by those on here, except all he has done is what a lot on here are calling for and switching the team around. 20 Posted 24/08/2026 at 13:15:33 Yes Stu - as Anthony stated - two things can be true at the same time. It was a major uplift to the team and a masterstroke at the time. Dyche didnt give him one minute. At the tail end of last season - for whatever reason, lack of focus, jaded mindset, unnatural fit of a 6ft 6in CB in the RB position - it surfaced as a problem and it became clear it began to unravel. That miss control for the first Sunderland goal was in part not having the right body shape and natural turn to the right side of a natural RB, caused the whole thing to blow up in our face. Still think the initial decision was a masterstroke for that season and in part getting us into a good position for potential European places. Moyes has corrected this in pre-season and on Saturday. He still may use JOB at RB on Wednesday if from the start or during the game he needs Rohl to move into CM to say replace Hackney to save him for the weekend. Clearly we need to get a new RB and the problem is fixed - for now. 22 Posted 24/08/2026 at 13:17:41 He was the only player to start 6 of the 7 games Came on as sub in the 7th so the only player to play a part in every game Had more minutes than anyone else. While it is easy to say he should have played, nobody ever says who he should have replaced? Garner? KDH? Gueye? N'diaye? The only option was McNeil but everyone was saying he should not be stuck out on the wing. All well and good to say he should be played, but how? We can't play 12 players. 23 Posted 24/08/2026 at 13:20:09 However, he should take the credit (players too) for the turnaround after Sean Dyche left. Last year some things continued to improve but the biggest factor as to why Everton had a chance of European qualification was that Chelsea, Tottenham, Newcastle and Forest were having poor seasons. And in reality there were several other clubs apart from ourselves till who had a chance of European qualification during the last few games. For me, Grealish's injury in particular led Moyes to return to his most cautious and pragmatic version. I think the club will keep him on this season. Whether he gets Everton to qualify for Europe this season really depends on having few major injuries and making some key signings over the next several days and some other clubs having poorer seasons (Villa, Forest, Spurs, Sunderland, Bournemouth, Brentford, etc). 24 Posted 24/08/2026 at 13:32:36 It's a pathetic deflection and you've used it numerous times. Everyone and their dog knows Moyes is hopeless, absolutely hopeless, at making full use of the squad available, and the number of subs allowed. If you can't figure out for yourself how that might have been used to make sure Armstrong continued to get vital playing minutes last season, I can't help you. 25 Posted 24/08/2026 at 13:33:20 "I will never hide the fact that I think Moyes is the wrong manager. No, he isn't building a strong foundation -- arguably successive managers after his first term struggled to overcome the mess he created." A mess of a squad that Martinez in his first season got us to 5th position with 72 points. Sorry Stu - this is a non fact - he did not leave a mess. 26 Posted 24/08/2026 at 13:48:23 To answer your question about last season, one of Keane or Tarkowski should have been left out, O’Brien played centrally and Patterson (or, it turns out, maybe Röhl) played at right back. Dibling and George should have been given time on the wings in place of Röhl/McNeil and even N’Diaye, who should have been used as an impact substitute rather than being flogged for 90 minutes every match. Alcaraz should have had time on the pitch, either in place of Dewsbury-Hall when he looked knackered, or Gueye (who always looked knackered) with Dewsbury-Hall dropping into his more natural position alongside Garner - especially when the match situation required us to push for the next goal. Aznou should have come on for Mykolenko in those situations too. Armstrong could have replaced Gueye, either from the start or with 25-30 minutes remaining. Even if these things hadn’t worked, we’d be no worse off than we were, and we’d have developed and improved young players through experience. I don’t think I’m such a genius that no-one else can think of these things. I think lots of people saw these things, but apparently they never occurred to Moyes or anyone else on the coaching staff. There are more than 11 players in the squad good enough to be on the pitch. Some of them should start on Wednesday. We should also consider the Carabao Cup to be our best chance of a trophy and take it very, very seriously. This, again, is not binary. There is a trade off between being strong and making sure everyone in the squad gets match fit and feels involved. Pickford didn’t do pre-season, so needs games. No-one is ‘knackered’ so no-one needs resting. Dibling needs to play, Alcaraz needs to play. Branthwaite will presumably be replaced by O’Brien as a precaution, so Tarkowski needs to play so that you haven’t changed both centre backs. If Röhl is going to be our right-back, he needs to play there to become more familiar with the position. Hackney, George and Armstrong need games and Barry is also probably better off staying in as they’ve all started well and you don’t want to interrupt that. I don’t know much about Aznou, but he needs to be given a chance and this is the best opportunity we’ll get for a long time. Again, this is Moyes’ job. It’s not that difficult and he’s very well paid for it. It should be something like: Pickford Röhl - Tarkowski - O’Brien - Aznou Hackney - Armstrong Dibling - Alcaraz - George Barry Subs planned to bring on: Johnson, N’Diaye, Garner, Dewsbury-Hall. Ready if needed: Mykolenko, Branthwaite and Patterson. Some players continue their momentum, other players get their chance, substitutions make the team stronger as the game goes on and a clear signal is sent out that Everton mean business. 27 Posted 24/08/2026 at 13:49:23 Armstrong will be benched as soon as Garner is deemed fit enough to start. 28 Posted 24/08/2026 at 14:27:51 To quote you Yes Stu - as Anthony stated - two things can be true at the same time The bounce we saw from Martinez may well be that 2 worlds colliding caused a perfect storm. The moment the more progressive manager tried to unpick the rigid foundations the following seasons, the wheels fell off. But hey, after 16 years of failure Moyes might prove me wrong 29 Posted 24/08/2026 at 14:28:06 Better to use last season as a representative sample: Net spend - £96.9 million Players used to - 20th Subs made - 20th Minutes by sub - 20th The average age of signings in Moyes' second spell - under 24 Minutes by players under 24 years old - 17th Moyes did not use substitutes properly, he did not rotate the squad and he did not give enough minutes to the young players the club signed for him. Garner, KDH, Gueye and Ndiaye could have all been dropped at stages last season. Garner and KDH fell away badly from March onwards, while Gueye and Ndiaye were poor after Afcon. Will he learn the lessons this season? He played the youngsters on Saturday and they did him proud; let’s see if they keep thei places when Garner and Norgaard are fully fit. As for subs, Palace had 5 fresh players on the field before we made a single substitution on Saturday. It gave them momentum in the game instead of us pushing on. 30 Posted 24/08/2026 at 14:35:19 The reason I feel like this is that I think such articles or statements are premature, just like the one the club put out after we won at Old Trafford last season, thanking everyone for staying with the club through the dark times, like we had just won the European Cup. Some people like Moyes, a lot of people think he is an okay manager, and some people think he would be a lot better manager if he was braver and was prepared to rotate and keep his squad fresh, competitive and involved. I personally think I need to see how the season develops before I can say if I've got any real faith in David Moyes, other than him returning us to mediocrity. 31 Posted 24/08/2026 at 14:36:17 Beyond that, his style of football, pragmatic tactics and team selections impose a ceiling and limit progress. It's all very safe and won't change. That might suit our owners currently, but if you want to move the club forwards, I don't think he's the man. If they thought he was, then you'd assume they'd give him a longer contract, which he'd like. So we're currently the in-betweeners. Transfer committee pushing youth and potential, Moyes pushing experience. Moyes's tenure has a fixed timeline. The owners won't back all of his proposed signings. So we are treading water somewhat this season. It would have made sense, when a number of younger managers were available this Summer, to negotiate an amicable settlement and let Moyes take the Scotland job. 32 Posted 24/08/2026 at 14:43:08 It was poor by Moyes to bring Garner on against Palace when he was nowhere near the pace. But, like last season and his 11 years before, Moyes drains his players. George and Barry should both have gone off 15 minutes earlier, they had run their race. Moyes is here at least till the end of the season... absolute no doubt. I know the squad quality is way better than last season, so the owners won't bother Moyes you must be mad if you cant see that. Keep the faith -- we're moving forward... that's for sure. 33 Posted 24/08/2026 at 14:54:18 Well in. There have been two unique comments here that have grabbed my attention. One is Steve Jones's characterization of Moyes's installation of O'Brien at right-back as a "masterstroke" -- which, on reflection, it was. He took an unused player off the end of his bench and stuck him in a position he'd never played. Nobody else had thought of it. The club promptly roared off the bottom to achieve security by season's end, and then went on to have a very good 4/5ths of a season before the wheels came off, all with Jake in that obviously uncomfortable position. Steve's conclusion is hard to argue. The other is Ian Wilkins's remark about "letting" Moyes take the Scotland job. There was never the slightest indication that he was interested in that position. The mere fact that he's a Scot lends little credibility to the idea that Moyes would leave a Premier League club that contended for Europe last season for an adrift national team program (#42 in the world) at a 90% cut from his current pay level. It never made a bit of sense for Moyes, and it clearly made no sense for the employer who -- for better or worse -- holds him in high regard. 34 Posted 24/08/2026 at 15:12:44 I saw what you said there, whilst smoking some Ogden's Nutty Flake perhaps? 35 Posted 24/08/2026 at 15:28:30 That's the problem with Moyes, no matter how well the youngsters play, he'll go back to the tried and trusted, and maybe give them the last 10 or 15 minutes at the end of a game. He's still whinging that the finish at the end of last season wasn't a failure. We didn't win any of our last seven games, Ndiaye and Dewsbury-Hall were running on empty, he never changed Tarkowski and Keane, and never freshened the team up, leaving George, Armstrong and Alcaraz sitting on the bench, and then having a go at the fans who thought we should have done better? 36 Posted 24/08/2026 at 15:35:41 There would be all these caveats -- ‘Well, if he didn't have Pickford making all those wonder-saves… The League was crap this season... and if Arsenal hadn't had that injury-crisis... he got very lucky, Moyes -- if he hadn't got that striker on deadline day who scored 30 goals, it would've never happened... and he never gave Dibling enough game-time... awful manager, useless.' 37 Posted 24/08/2026 at 15:50:49 He has consistently met one basic criterion, which is to keep the club in the Premier League every year he has managed us, and mostly through times when money has been in very short supply. If staying in the Premier League was the limit of your ambition, you'd pick Moyes; he will almost certainly deliver that and needs not much better than a mediocre squad to do it. And that really comes back to the owners. What do you want? Safety or risk? Stick or twist? There has been much fighting talk from our CEO on this but I don't see any real evidence for those ambitions beyond merely stating them. My hunch is that their version of our immediate future is take these couple of years when we have the potential to significantly grow our revenue year on year, first via the stadium, then by smarter commercial, and get us to £300M plus but with the SCR well within the limit (and maybe closer to the European limit of 70%). Then you have to decide whether you are willing to give it a go because, from that point, only Champions League will seriously grow our revenue in a step-jump way. Aston Villa and Newcastle are maybe canaries in the coal mine for our owners: what happens when you fly too close to the sun. They've already made what I suspect is a very nice paper profit on their transaction, having deservedly mugged Moshiri, and they may not wish to put that at risk. On that line of reasoning, we may be stuck with Moyes for longer than you think... and while I know Mike G disagrees, I wouldn't be surprised to see us flipped in the next few years. If they choose not to renew Moyes's contract next year and go for a younger, hungrier manager, then we'll be in for a much more exciting ride. 38 Posted 24/08/2026 at 15:53:47 I don't think any of us would profess to know what it takes to manage a Premier League club, but that doesn't mean we can't have objective opinions based on years of experience as fans. I personally don't think Moyes knows what it is like to be a true fan of Everton but he still has opinions of us, but from a different perspective. If this was Moyes's first third season in charge, I suspect most of his critics would be more forgiving. But we are in a "boy who cried wolf" situation... so, even if he does change, it's almost too late in his career -- or certainly too early this season -- to determine whether he will get the slack that change deserves. Like Tony said, though, it's too early for this article and I also agree, and have stated previously, a more adventurous approach could yet change the opinion of some of us -- but that hasn't happened yet. 39 Posted 24/08/2026 at 16:11:27 I think you might be in the wrong place if you're upset that fans have opinions about football. There's so much wrong with your post, on so many levels, that it is hard to know where to start. So I won't. Next time, argue a case rather than using weak sarcasm to dismiss the very idea of anyone else daring to argue theirs. I can promise you, if he won the league without conceding a goal, he'd get nothing but praise from anyone. He gets criticism because he deserves it and it's justified. Try engaging with what people are actually saying -- which bit of the criticism do you think is incorrect? Or are we just not allowed to have opinions at all? 40 Posted 24/08/2026 at 16:19:45 Speak for yourself. I've won the Champions League in Football Manager with Everton. :) 41 Posted 24/08/2026 at 16:27:41 Bids also expected for Beto. So keep Keane, make Tarkowski captain and sell O'Brien. Hilarious. 42 Posted 24/08/2026 at 16:38:52 But I wouldn't be surprised. 43 Posted 24/08/2026 at 16:43:11 Classic Moyes imo. Jake O'Brien was doomed from the moment he told him he didn't want to play right-back anymore. 44 Posted 24/08/2026 at 16:50:27 We shouldn't be selling off our future to accommodate the fact that our manager prioritises physicality over creativity at right-back, or the fact he's besotted with Tarkowski, who's past his best, at the expense of a young, bright giant of a man in O'Brien. 45 Posted 24/08/2026 at 16:52:09 46 Posted 24/08/2026 at 16:58:06 Maybe O'Brien is tired of being 4th choice centre-back and wants more game time in the middle. 47 Posted 24/08/2026 at 17:01:41 I can understand this, Jake must have thought when he said no more full-back that he'd be given a go in the centre, and that just hasn't happened. Moyes just prefers Tarkowski (who never gets injured). He Just can't face another year on the bench, and I don't blame him. He could be one frustrated boy if the right offer doesn't present and/or we can't source a replacement. I suspect this announcement is a favour to him, so he's clear that we did try and do right by him, so that he will knuckle down if it all goes pear-shaped! 48 Posted 24/08/2026 at 17:32:01 Sorry for doing ToffeeWeb wrong; I'll just stick to reading it from now on. 49 Posted 24/08/2026 at 17:32:32 How many times has he started for Ireland? Another good question. Not a regular starter for the 55th-ranked team in the world. Apart from being 8½ years younger than Tarkowski, where else is he better?\ We bought him for £16.5M. If we can sell him at a profit, are there better and/or younger options out there? Please take off the rose-tinted glasses before answering. 50 Posted 24/08/2026 at 17:38:01 To me, I don't think he offers anything more than Tarkowski or Keane apart from being younger and a bit more mobile. Saying that, though, it would be insane to sell him if there isn't somebody else in the pipeline -- and not somebody the wrong side of 30! 51 Posted 24/08/2026 at 17:38:08 Why keep two old ones when we've got two younger -- and possibly better? This club -- if they do sell -- is just unbelievable! 52 Posted 24/08/2026 at 17:44:31 He won't be at the club next season. 53 Posted 24/08/2026 at 17:48:04 54 Posted 24/08/2026 at 17:50:59 Who knows what the ins and outs will be in this window? I've no doubt there will be a surprise or two... The usual suspects have been hoovering up all the talent off the other teams in the Premier League and elsewhere while we have been shopping at Aldi. It's little wonder that we know who the Top 4 will probably be. 55 Posted 24/08/2026 at 18:21:06 He saves us from relegation, stabilizes the club last season, slowly is rebuilding the side with clever signings, young players showing up well, an impressive start to the season albeit only one game in, yet the knives are still out at the gunfight for him. I really hope he makes you eat Lineker's soiled shorts at the end of the season when he gets us into Europe. It must grate you like sand in your underpants to think Moyes will do well. I relish the thought of you squirming at the thought. 56 Posted 24/08/2026 at 18:22:40 If not, who else is there that would bring in enough profit (if your hands are tied)? 57 Posted 24/08/2026 at 18:23:19 Check again, O'Brien was a regular starter in a back three and back four for Ireland in the World Cup campaign. I think you should take off the rose-tinted glasses, so sell a 25-year-old 6'-6" centre-back and keep two 33-year-olds in Tarkowski and Keane. Moyes would still have to sign another centre-back, and hope Branthwaite stays fit... absolute madness. When Jake played centre-back against Forest last season, he was immense. It's typical Moyes, because he probably told him, he didn't want to play full-back anymore? 58 Posted 24/08/2026 at 18:36:18 "He saves us from relegation, stabilizes the club last season, slowly is rebuilding the side with clever signings, young players showing up well." What you are praising Moyes for at Everton, Sean Dyche had already done: he rescued Everton from relegation, earned 48 points on the pitch in 2023-24 despite an 8-point PSR deduction, built one of the Premier League's best defences and beat Liverpool 2–0 at Goodison. He also recruited and developed young players who remain important to Everton, including Iliman Ndiaye, Jake O'Brien and Tim Iroegbunam, while giving Branthwaite his breakthrough. Moyes deserves some credit, but much of this isn't unprecedented at Everton — Dyche had already achieved remarkably similar things in more difficult circumstances. 59 Posted 24/08/2026 at 18:54:26 I'd be more pissed off and worried if we'd brought a load of old journeymen in this summer, like many predicted. I hate the negativity, the tempering expectations, the "aim low to overachieve" attitude, but I can also still hope we do well under him, knowing he's here unless we are truly terrible. I'll still be unbiased if we play well, his selections are good, the signings we've made. He was always a divisive appointment. There's many that don't even care if he does amazing, they don't want him, didn't want him, and will lay everything at his door -- performances, wins, signings, Champions League football won't change that... So don't expect people's opinions to change even if we are flying. That's the reason I didn't want him back: he'll never have 100% support... not many managers do, but they don't start with a huge percentage who already have made up their minds and have previous gripes with him. 60 Posted 24/08/2026 at 18:56:19 Now, seeing Moyes make Tarkowski club captain, giving himself an excuse to pick him every week, has probably made Jake realise he would need to move on to play. It wasn't a masterstroke to play him there. I honestly can't remember Patterson having a game bad enough for us that successive managers would not play him. David Moyes has played players out of position for years, and is terrified of dropping senior players, which suggests to me he cannot man-manage. He's had both enough slack, and more than enough rope. Time for the pitchforks 61 Posted 24/08/2026 at 19:21:01 Do you remember Patterson having a good game? Moyes isn't holding back this super-talented right-back from setting the world alight. Playing O'Brien at right-back was -- 'was' is the important word -- a good decision. Patterson is clearly not good enough at this level. Continuing to use O'Brien or relying on Rohl this season, and not bringing in someone, would be a much worse decision. 62 Posted 24/08/2026 at 19:48:15 63 Posted 24/08/2026 at 19:55:36 His is the kind of perseverance that Everton should be embracing for the long-term, not shipping out to somebody else. If Moyes does this, and TFG approves it, they are morons. 64 Posted 24/08/2026 at 21:03:06 If he gets us into Europe, I sincerely hope it's because we win one of the cup competitions, mate.🤞 65 Posted 24/08/2026 at 21:14:16 As soon as I read the captaincy award, I was worried... If Jake goes, it's on Moyes's head... unbelievable stuff! 66 Posted 24/08/2026 at 21:18:25 What other professional football club anywhere would consider this! If this happens, Moyes is more of a tosser than I thought. 67 Posted 24/08/2026 at 21:28:21 We cannot afford to lose O'Brien -- making Tarkowski captain probably shut any chance of him getting a starting place in the middle. But if he sells him, doesn't Moyes know we're down to three centre-backs, or is he going to put more square pegs in round holes??? 68 Posted 24/08/2026 at 22:02:28 69 Posted 24/08/2026 at 22:13:47 Somebody hasn't been paying attention. Over the past two seasons we have all seen Jake start nine games at center back, playing the full 90 in all. Our record in those nine games is five wins, two draws, two losses, with just 6 goals given up. Yep. We rate him. 70 Posted 24/08/2026 at 22:14:24 71 Posted 24/08/2026 at 22:35:51 Either he’s pushing hard to go because he doesn’t see any football time, in which case Moyes needs to manage him, and his game time, as he would have to with a deeper squad. Or we have replacements lined up. I’m not convinced of the latter. 72 Posted 24/08/2026 at 22:51:09 With Moyes...and to be fair, all the others...there's always a sighting of 1 swallow and I've lost count of the number of false dawns, but up to now they've never amounted to anything. Moyes Always reverts, he can't help himself, we've all heard of TACO, well meet MACO Moyes Always Chickens Out. And on past performance, which is all we have to go on - If Norgaard and Garner were fit there's no way that Hackney and Armstrong start on Saturday. Prove. Me. Wrong. Played 1; Won 1. One win is not a trend. Seven at the end of last season, now thats a trend. You're not 'only as good as your last game' - that's history...and nobody knows just how good or bad Palace will turn out to be this season, ( or us for that matter!...which I presume is the whole point of the piece) you're only as good as your next game 'Show me the money' as it were. Nobody would love it more than me - but I'll not hold me breath. Add Your Comments In order to post a comment, you need to be logged in as a registered user of the site. Or Sign up as a ToffeeWeb Member — it's free, takes just a few minutes and will allow you to post your comments on articles and Talking Points submissions across the site. How to get rid of these ads and support TW